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Guest: Amy-Jill Levine, PhD
University Professor of New Testament and Jewish Studies
Mary Jane Werthan Professor in Jewish Studies
Professor of Jewish Studies
Amy-Jill Levine is University Professor of New Testament and Jewish Studies, Mary Jane Werthan Professor of Jewish Studies, and Professor of New Testament Studies at Vanderbilt Divinity School and College of Arts and Science; she is also Affiliated Professor, Centre for the Study of Jewish-Christian Relations, Cambridge UK.
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Daniel J. Kirk writes and speaks about the big story of the Bible and how it intersects with life, faith, and culture. He earned a Ph.D. in New Testament from Duke University and taught in a variety of institutions over a ten-year teaching career. He lives in San Francisco with his wife Laura and two school-aged children. His back yard has been overrun by chickens who have no interest in being confined to their designated space, and his refrigerator is regularly stocked with his homebrewed Cursing Reverend beer.
Shownotes Episode 16 – Apophatic prayer explained in a conversation with Dr. Laurie Mellinger.
Laurie Mellinger, Ph.D.
Associate Professor of Spiritual Formation and Christian Theology
Dean of Academic Programs
B.A. Millersville University; M.A.R. Evangelical School of Theology; Ph.D. The Catholic University of America
Get your spiffy guide to the ancient Christian prayer practice of praying using Scripture called Lectio Divina (latin for “sacred reading”). It’s the perfect go-to reference and resource to get started with the four movements of Lectio that lead us to praying without words and listening to God.
A donation of 50¢ or more will get you this essential Lectio Divina resource. Click HERE to download it now!
Encountering and examining Apophatic (contemplative) Prayer
How we are over-stimulated. Children get overstimulated and need naps which means they get silence and solitude and lack of stimulation. Silence and solitude are restorative.
37:00
The demons we encounter in solitude or in the desert.
38:30
A clean and swept room, removed of clutter makes us more aware of new things that might be wrong.
One kind of prayer isn’t better (per se), but God is forming and reform and transforms us back into the image of Christ. God must reform us. In God’s presence we will feel more loved and acceptance and he might put his finger on something to take care of.
Luke 11:24-26
24“When the unclean spirit goes out of a man, it passes through waterless places seeking rest, and not finding any, it says, ‘I will return to my house from which I came.’ 25“And when it comes, it finds it swept and put in order. 26“Then it goes and takes alongseven other spirits more evil than itself, and they go in and live there; and the last state of that man becomes worse than the first.”
43:30
on…The messy interior work needed to be more like Jesus.
Letting God dig around.
43:30
Helpful and practical advice for getting started with apophatic and contemplative prayer.
Practice reading the Bible and using the text to help you pray and wait. (Lectio Divina)
“That waiting (in prayer) is the entry into apophatic prayer.”
(paraphrase) “If you are still counting the steps, you aren’t dancing yet. You are still learning to dance.”
47:30
Prayer can become flow.
48:30
Union with God – The traditional understand of the goal of apophatic prayer.
50:00
God invites us corporately and individually as human beings into that (triune) relational and our participation in that relationship is what I mean by union with God.”
Sensing the presence and love of God more fully, and more and more fully. This is union with God.
51:00
Western goal in Christianity is often understand (first) as Salvation in terms of Penal Atonement and payment for sin. It is a more judicial angle compared to what Eastern Christians do. It’s much more about relationship restored.
Shane is a Soul Friend (Spiritual Director) with a focus on artists and creatives, be they “yuccies”, “slashies”, painters, musicians, or any one in need of deeper and more sustaining, soul-level communing.
How we find spark:
Together, we make the Spark My Muse podcast happen.
I prepare something and you digest it.
I invite you to just listen, read the show notes and click on links, and give what you can.
That’s all. :)
• If it’s worth nothing…um what? Are you serious? This just got more awkward..Aw…snap! I sincerely apologize. Let me know what I can improve and please come back and listen again soon!
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simply, tap into the river of gratitude in your heart and contribute what you can– HERE or use that Paypal button, over yonder.
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• A trained Anam Cara (soul friend in the Irish Tradition).
• He lived with his wife and family in Ireland for 11 years!
Conversation (podcast) notes:
MINUTE 3:00
How Shane and his wife and family happened to live in Ireland for 11 years.
4:15
How God begins to grow dreams in us
Working at the Willow Creek Church
People have long said that still seems true. When foreigners come that end up being more Irish than the Irish themselves.
7:20
One of the most potent lessons learned from the Irish was the necessity to put people first. They take time to connect with each other and share life.
9:00 A sense of call to minister to artist and creatives.
9:40 On why he feels a passion to serve the creative community: “I believe the creative of today is the prophet of old”. It is a prophetic call.
10:10
“Creatives are called to paint a picture of the future that God is calling us all into. His Kingdom coming.”
10:50
“When a creative (person) using their gift…it taps into something deep inside of us and reverberates…and it feels like echoes of home.”
12:00
Jesus invites us to “walk with me and work with me.”
12:20
answering: What is Spiritual Direction (or soul friendship) actually?
13:00
A soul friend is “the best friend you’ve always wanted.”
and the Saint Bridgette quote…
13:50
A good picture is in the New Testament of the friends walking to Emmaus and then Jesus come in their midst. Unpacking life.
14:00
“The Soul Friend is someone who helps us see how God has been at work in our lives…so we can (as St. Ignatius says) “to recklessly abandon ourselves to his loving care.”
15:20
The problem with the phrase “Spiritual Director” on two counts so I use “soul friend”.
18:00
How he was trained in soul care and soul friendship
21:00
On becoming an Anglican Priest…
25:00
What he find to be the deepest needs of the creative community he works with?
Affirmation and Presence
30:00
Living in a Creative Age (moving from head to heart)
31:30
There’s an affective moving in society leading with Beauty first and then Truth that leads to freedom.
32:00
Alan Crieder
Behave Belong Believe (in which order should be in what era)
33:20
“What the heart loves, the will chooses, and the mind justifies.”
35:00
The error of focusing too much on trying to convince people just intellectually.
36:00
Ignatian Spirituality
Celtic Spirituality
Soul Friendship
by Rev Ray Simpson (Church of England)
The Celtic Way of Prayer
by Ester De Waal
Holy Companions
42:30
on the hospitality and generosity of Irish spirituality.
The story of an Inn with 7 doors for the 7 roads.
Thank you so much for listening to the show!
To get alerts of the topics and the new and interesting folks coming to the podcast in future episode click HERE.
Here’s a tasting of who’s coming in the next few months:
Today, I’m happy to feature a friend of mine, Thomas Turner. If you’ve read this blog over the last few, Thomas and I have been on each other’s blogs. (See his bio at the bottom)
He just created something that will enrich your Advent Season and give your family a deeper based from which to praise, worship and pray to prepare your hearts for the Christ Child this Christmas.
I urge you to get this book (see how to get it free at Noisetrade below) and include the reading of it in your supper time ritual like we are doing in my home.
Thomas Turner is the Strategic Partnerships Research Manager at International Justice Mission and curates Everyday Liturgy, a source for worship and liturgical ideas. He is happy to be living back below the Mason-Dixon line again after a lengthy sojourn in the NYC metro area. You can follow Thomas online, on Facebook and on Twitter.
Guest: Amy-Jill Levine, PhD
A conversation with Shane Tucker: